XR650L w/650R CS Sprocket Protects Splines

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XR650L w/650R CS Sprocket Protects Splines

Post by 4Strokes » Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:07 pm

Topic: XR650L with XR650R CS Sprocket Protects CS Splines
Author: SpudRider
Posted: 03/21/2011 8:20:54 PM

I frequently examine the countershaft splines on my XR650L. However, I admit, my eyes aren’t as good as they used to be. Advancing into middle age, I’ve acquired presbyopia. The last time I inspected the countershaft splines, they appeared quite good to my unaided eyes. Therefore, after I greased the countershaft splines, I took a few photographs, and went riding.

However, I had noticed a hint of rust on both the countershaft, and the sprocket. Rapidly approaching 10,000 miles on my bike’s odometer, my nagging conscience prompted me to examine the photographs I had taken. Closely examining the macro photos, I thought I detected some countershaft spline wear.
Winterridemarch13023.JPG
Therefore, I went outside, removed some grease, and examined the countershaft with a magnifying glass. Indeed, I discovered the countershaft splines were beginning to wear.
countershaftsplines007.jpg
Closely examining the Parts Unlimited sprocket I had just removed, I believe I also detected some wear on the trailing edges of the inside teeth.
Winterridemarch13019.JPG
Previously, I drank the XR650R, countershaft sprocket, Kool-Aid. I had planned to wait until my current countershaft sprocket needed replacement before making the switch. However, I now decided to act immediately!

I had shortened my drive chain to 108 links with my current 13T/45T sprocket combination. Therefore, I needed to acquire a 13T, XR650R, countershaft sprocket as quickly as possible. I did some research, and discovered I could obtain a 13T, PBI sprocket in 24 hours. The XR650R countershaft sprocket has 60 percent more contact area with the countershaft than the XR650L countershaft sprocket.
XR650RSprocketfromPBI007.JPG
Mounted backwards, the sprocket teeth of the XR650R sprocket are 2.5 mm farther from the engine. Based upon the experience of others, I don't think this will present a problem. In any event, I am perfectly willing to accept greater sprocket wear, and/or greater drive chain wear, rather than any additional wear on the countershaft splines.
XR650RSprocketfromPBI004.JPG
I needed to tap lightly on the PBI sprocket with a hammer to allow me to install the sprocket retainer. Heeding Dave's admonition regarding PBI sprockets, I examined the alignment of the sprocket retainer. The alignment isn't perfect, but it should be robust enough.
XR650RSprocketfromPBI010.JPG
I went for a ride, and everything felt good. I will routinely inspect the drive chain, and both sprockets for unusual wear. More importantly, I am going to routinely inspect the countershaft splines under magnification to ensure I have stopped the wear.
XR650RSprocketfromPBI019.JPG
Spud

Reply by jrsride2002 on 03/22/2011 11:13:24 AM
Good Idea Spud! I hadn't thought of using the 650R sprockets before.. Imma have to look into this now! I have already replaced on counter shaft, and my current one has a chip missing from it right now, so it's going to need replacing sometime soon.

Keep up up dated on this post, I can see the potential of a lot of man hours or cash savings just from this simple replacement!!

Do you guys think that the counter shaft itself could be a replacement part for the 650L?

Good work dude! ~Junior

Reply by SpudRider on 03/22/2011 6:16:42 PM
Thank you, Junior. I'm just following the lead of others who have experimented with the XR650R countershaft sprocket. Everyone who has tried the XR650R countershaft sprocket has given good reports on it, so I have been converted! I will certainly keep everyone updated.

I might be wrong, but I don't think the XR650R countershaft will work as a replacement for the XR650L countershaft. However, I think the XR650L countershaft splines will not suffer damage if one employs the wider, XR650R countershaft sprocket. Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 03/26/2011 01:27:26 AM
The following manufacturers produce 13T countershaft sprockets for the XR650R motorcycle.
  • Moose Racing: Part #M602-20-13
  • AFAM: Part #20517-13
  • Sprocket Specialists: Part #617-13
  • PBI Sprockets: Part #50-386-13
Spud

Reply by Lancester on 03/26/2011 10:02:34 AM
When I went to my Moose 14 tooth sprocket, it was obviously wider. I was worried at first that it might be the wrong part, but now it makes sense. They must have seen the advantage to a wider sprocket & that's what they sell as a XR650L piece.

Reply by dusty trail on 03/29/2011 7:03:30 PM
Originally posted by jrsride2002
Do you guys think that the counter shaft itself could be a replacement part for the XR650L?~Junior
When I rebuilt my xr650l a couple of years ago with over 40,000 miles on it, I HAD to replace the countershaft. That meant splitting the case. The splines had worn down to only about 1/32" or so thick. My xr is the only bike I have ever noticed any countershaft wear on at all. I must say this is the first time I had seen anyone put grease on those splines. What purpose does that serve? Would seem to me that having grease there would attract more grit in that area and accelerate wear. Dusty

Reply by SpudRider on 03/29/2011 8:01:23 PM
Dusty; Many XR650L owners believe rust accelerates wear on the countershaft splines; therefore, they recommend greasing the splines. I now believe rust is a symptom of countershaft wear, and not the cause. Therefore, I no longer grease my countershaft splines. I'm convinced small spline area, engine torque, and the lack of a cush drive are the causes of XR650L countershaft wear. I'm also convinced the XR650R countershaft sprocket is the cure for this ailment. Spud

Reply by dave_cl on 03/30/2011 08:38:50 AM
Grease will still help to alleviate wear, even if rust is a symptom not a cause. Metal moving around on on metal with a load on it, lessen the friction, lessen the wear, the movement per-rotation or per-whatever isn't much but it adds up, especially as the torque transferred is pretty high. Dave

Reply by SpudRider on 03/30/2011 10:17:53 AM
That's seems logical to me, Dave. I guess a little grease on the countershaft splines certainly can't hurt anything, and probably will help as you stated. I never heard of anyone else greasing the countershaft splines on another motorcycle. Do other riders employ this practice, or are the XR650L owners unique in this respect? Spud

Reply by bbultema on 03/30/2011 7:38:42 PM
Every time you hit the chain with a little chain lube I think you should hit the splines on the front sprocket. I always try to get some in there. On the farm they recommend that chains that run under severe conditions get oiled after the day is over to let the oil pass through the dirt to where it needs to be.

Reply by dave_cl on 03/31/2011 12:52:02 PM
I think there are just not many thumper that see street duty that don't have a cush drive that have a sprocket that is both 'loose' and 'narrow' like the XRL, so this problem simply does not occur on other bikes. With each power stroke the splines beat against the sprocket, whack whack whack whack. Dave

Reply by SpudRider on 04/06/2011 11:17:10 PM
Today I mounted a new Dunlop, D606 rear tire. At that time I seized the opportunity to remove my XR650R countershaft sprocket to examine both the sprocket itself, and the countershaft splines. Here is a photograph of the "front" side of my XRR sprocket, as mounted (reversed) on my XR650L, with 1,200 miles of wear.
CSSplinesChainRollerInspection017.JPG
Here is the "back" side of my XRR sprocket, as mounted (reversed) on my XR650L, with 1,200 miles of wear. My XRL sprocket actually exhibited more wear on the back side than this XRR sprocket, so I am very pleased.
CSSplinesChainRollerInspection008.JPG
Here is a photo of my countershaft splines after using the XRR sprocket for 1,200 miles.
CSSplinesChainRollerInspection006.JPG
Here is a comparison photograph of the countershaft splines at 10,000 miles, just before I installed the XRR sprocket.
countershaftsplines007.jpg
My rear sprocket is in excellent condition; I did not note any significant wear. My drive chain is also in excellent condition. My XRR countershaft sprocket came off easily by hand, and reinstalled easily, by hand. The sprocket retainer is in excellent condition, and mounts securely to the sprocket and countershaft. So far, I am very pleased with my XR650R countershaft sprocket, and I intend to continue using the XRR CS sprocket. Spud

Reply by jrsride2002 on 05/02/2011 08:43:55 AM
Well i went for it Head first And it kinda hurt. I bought a JT XRR sprocket, the stock 15 tooth. And it was WAY to big. The sprocket would not go on the shaft deep enough for the retention clip to be bolted on, the clip it self would just sit on the very end of the counter shaft. The sprocket needed to modified to slide further down the shaft for the clip to be bolted in.

What I ended up doing was using a grinding stone on my drill press and slowly going at it. The fitted result looks like this:
Sprocket1.jpg
The grinding also changed the color of the sprocket. Was a nice pretty silver, but now has the heated copper color to it:
Sprocket2.jpg
I used some spray paint to tell me how much was metal was removed. I had to go and buy a grinding stone to do the job. The one I got is a "Craftsmen 1" rotary grinding point":
00964728000-1.jpg
All in all, I dont think it was really worth all the time I put into it. Then again maybe there is a good reason, that someone else could see I that cant?? I don't know. I do have a working XRR sprocket tho! ~Junior

Reply by dave_cl on 05/02/2011 09:22:29 AM
You will still have a more spline-spline contact than the stocker. Dave

Reply by SpudRider on 05/02/2011 10:03:45 AM
I didn't need to grind my XR650R sprocket; when I met some resistance, I lightly tapped the sprocket onto the countershaft with a hammer. After riding 1,200 miles with the XRR sprocket, I easily removed it, and re-installed it by hand. I am very happy with the 60 percent increase in contact area the XR650R sprocket makes with the countershaft splines.
jtf1307jpg.JPG
jtf1309jpg.jpg
Spud

Reply by jrsride2002 on 05/02/2011 1:19:24 PM
Oh, don't get me wrong. I am TOTALLY down for the continuous use of the XRR sprocket. I have already had the shaft replaced once, for a costly some of $1200. But I also had some work don't to the motor and few other things so i'm sure just the replacement would have been cheaper.

What I was leaning more towards was, I don't think I will go with a JT sprocket the next time I have to replace it.

I get worried about how much "Tapping" is required to force the sprocket to move up the shaft just to fit. What I worry about is everything that is attached to the shaft. Like the bearings, and the transmission drum and all those goodies that i know absolutely NOTHING about. I get that the bike was designed to take a huge stress tolerance to abuse from the direction of the crank, but I don't know if Honda designed the motor to take abuse from a different direction. Does that make sense? That's why I didn't forcefully hammer the sprocket on in the manner you described.

Thanks for the other diagram! ~Junior

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XR650L w/650R CS Sprocket Protects Splines 2

Post by 4Strokes » Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:22 pm

Reply by SpudRider on 05/02/2011 1:33:00 PM
I agree, Junior. I would be very reluctant to "hammer" the XRR sprocket onto the countershaft, and I don't recommend this procedure to others. I only needed to tap lightly on my XR650R CS sprocket to get it onto the countershaft far enough to secure the retaining plate. If one discovers he needs to "hammer" the XRR sprocket onto the countershaft, I think he should either grind on the XRR sprocket, choose another brand of XRR sprocket, or keep using the XR650L sprocket. Spud

Reply by Carphunter on 05/03/2011 11:48:43 AM
removing my question about what the misalignment with the pbi sprocket you speak of is. figured it must be that when you slide the plate on, and then rotate it to bolt it to the sprocket, the plates teeth only grab a bit of the spline's teeth... not a perfect tooth to tooth match.

Reply by SpudRider on 05/03/2011 7:37:59 PM
Carphunter, You are correct. The tapped holes for the retaining plate bolts in the PBI sprocket are very slightly misaligned. However, the retaining plate still covers the countershaft splines very securely.

PBI currently manufacturers the XR650R countershaft sprockets for Moose Racing, and PBI, XR650R CS sprockets are also sold by XRs Only. Therefore, I personally will not hesitate to use the XR650R CS sprockets manufactured by PBI. Spud

Reply by dave_cl on 05/04/2011 09:28:17 AM
Wait- the PBI keeper holes are *still* misaligned? On a 650R sprocket? What the heck is wrong with PBI? I saw that problem on a PBI sprocket wipe out a countershaft once. I guess in this case the damage to the keeper caused by that is much lessened since the XR650R sprocket goes on so tight, but watch that keeper for wear. Dave

Reply by SpudRider on 05/04/2011 09:38:05 AM
Thanks for the tip, Dave. Indeed, I will keep inspecting the sprocket retainer. However, as you can see, this misalignment with the XR650R CS sprocket is very small, so I don't anticipate any problems.
XR650RSprocketfromPBI010.JPG
I believe PBI stopped manufacturing the XR650L CS sprocket; perhaps I overlooked it, but I can't find this sprocket in the PBI catalog. Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 05/07/2011 6:37:02 PM
Today I did some drive chain maintenance, so I removed my XR650R CS sprocket, and examined the countershaft splines. Here is a photograph of my countershaft after employing the XR650R CS sprocket for 4,000 miles.
XRLCSsplinesCSsprocket008.JPG
This is a photo of my countershaft after employing the XRR sprocket for 1,200 miles.
CSSplinesChainRollerInspection006.JPG
Here is a photo of my countershaft before I switched to the XRR CS sprocket.
countershaftsplines007.jpg
I am very pleased with the performance of my XR650R CS sprocket, and I plan to continue employing it on my motorcycle. Spud

Reply by Carphunter on 05/07/2011 6:49:44 PM
I've got a Sunstar 14 on order... seems to be one brand I hadn't seen mentioned yet in these threads... Figured I'd take one for the team and see how it fits.

Reply by SpudRider on 05/07/2011 7:07:24 PM
Here is a photograph of the "back" of my XR650R sprocket after 4,000 miles of wear.
XRLCSsplinesCSsprocket019.JPG
Here is a photo of the "front" of my XR650R sprocket after 4,000 miles of wear.
XRLCSsplinesCSsprocket023.JPG
I am pleased with the performance of my PBI, XR650R, countershaft sprocket. Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 05/07/2011 11:28:55 PM
Originally posted by Carphunter
I've got a Sunstar 14 on order... seems to be one brand I hadn't seen mentioned yet in these threads... Figured I'd take one for the team and see how it fits.
Please do keep us updated regarding your experience with the Sunstar CS sprocket, CH. Spud

Reply by dave_cl on 05/09/2011 10:13:43 AM
That sprocket is starting to show some wear. The 13's wear pretty quick. Dave

Reply by SpudRider on 05/09/2011 11:04:16 AM
Your visual acuity is quite good, Dave! I plan to switch to a 14T/48T sprocket combination once my current drive chain wears out. Spud

Reply by jjones006 on 05/09/2011 11:47:37 PM
today I stopped procrastinating on checking my counter shaft after I got done fabricating my smog block off,

the inside of the sprocket:
worninsidesprocket.jpg
the outside of the sprocket:
outsidedsprocket.jpg
What looks like "Moss" in this picture is white grease that I have been spraying in there ever since I found out about the excessive wear on the counter shaft that these bikes have, of course there is dirt accumulated with the white grease,it's just the lighting that makes it look the color it does:
mossshaft.jpg
it turns out that my counter shaft and sprocket are just fine. I even took a magnifying glass to them, they look good, pretty much no wear at all,granted from this inspection I am going to apply more white grease more often because as you can see there is some surface rust and when I go to get a new chain and sprocket I WILL put a XR650R counter shaft sprocket on it. also keep and mind that when I bought the bike (new) I had read that there is no cush drive in it and therefor have always pushed off with my feet and got the bike rolling before putting it into gear and try not to ever lug it, so operator habit probably helps in this case. I have 7417 miles ridden in.

Reply by RiverRunner on 05/16/2011 8:43:02 PM
Hi Folks, I put on a 14 tooth XRL Sunstar CS sprocket on my XRL yesterday. I had to "lightly" tap on the retainer to turn and fit the two bolts, but no problem what so ever.

The XRR sprocket sure grabs a much bigger chunk of real estate on the countershaft. I really appreciate the folks who brought this to our attention. This is just a great intuitive solution to a problem. A pretty good $30 investment for the long run. RiverRunner

Reply by SpudRider on 05/16/2011 9:15:59 PM
You're welcome, RiverRunner. Thank you for posting the good report on the Sunstar, XR650R countershaft sprocket! Spud

Reply by dave_cl on 05/23/2011 1:06:43 PM
8k miles or so:
vgDSC05280.JPG
pgDSC05281.JPG
pgDSC05275.JPG
Dave

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XR650L w/650R CS Sprocket Protects Splines 3

Post by 4Strokes » Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:52 pm

Reply by SpudRider on 05/23/2011 1:57:23 PM
The wear on your countershaft splines at 8,000 miles appears almost identical to the wear I noted on my splines when I bought my used bike with 7,800 miles on the odometer, Dave. As far as I know, the previous owner was primarily riding my bike on the street, with a 15T, Honda countershaft sprocket. Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 05/26/2011 11:31:06 PM
Today I needed to remove my rear wheel, so I took the opportunity to inspect my countershaft splines, and XRR CS sprocket. Here is my XR650L countershaft after employing the XR650R countershaft sprocket for 5,600 miles.
ChainrollersXRRsprocketinspection006.JPG
This is the first time I have not noticed any rust on my countershaft splines. It appears the XRR CS sprocket is doing an excellent job, and the wear on my countershaft splines has been arrested.

Here is the "front" of my XRR sprocket after 5,600 miles.
ChainrollersXRRsprocketinspection018.JPG
Here is the "back" of my XRR sprocket after 5,600 miles.
ChainrollersXRRsprocketinspection015.JPG
Since this 13T CS sprocket was beginning to show significant wear, I decided to replace it with a new, Moose Racing, XRR CS sprocket.
ChainrollersXRRsprocketinspection032.JPG
The new XRR sprocket and retaining plate installed easily by hand. It appears to me the Moose Racing, XRR CS sprockets are manufactured by PBI. Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 05/31/2011 12:51:59 AM
Here is a quick photographic review of my experience using the XR650R countershaft sprocket on my XR650L for the last 5,600 miles. First, here is a photo of my countershaft splines before I started employing the XR650R CS sprocket.
countershaftsplines007.jpg
This is a photo of my countershaft after employing the XRR sprocket for 1,200 miles.
CSSplinesChainRollerInspection006.JPG
Here is a photograph of my countershaft after employing the XR650R CS sprocket for 4,000 miles.
XRLCSsplinesCSsprocket008.JPG
Finally, here is my XR650L countershaft after employing the XR650R countershaft sprocket for 5,600 miles.
ChainrollersXRRsprocketinspection006.JPG
I have not noticed any unusual wear on either my sprockets, or my drive chain, while using the XR650R countershaft sprocket. I am very pleased with the results I have obtained employing the XR650R CS sprocket, and I plan to continue using it.
BlackrockCanyon5-22-11050.JPG
Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 06/18/2011 12:24:02 AM
Several days ago I needed to adjust the tension in my drive chain, so I took the opportunity to examine my countershaft splines, and my XR650R countershaft sprocket. Here is a photograph of my countershaft splines after employing the XR650R CS sprocket for 7,700 miles.
spudrollersandsplines018.JPG
I replaced my first, XR650R CS sprocket 2,100 miles ago. Here is photograph of the "front" of my current, XR650R, countershaft sprocket after 2,100 miles of wear.
spudrollersandsplines033.JPG
Here is a photo of the "back" of my XR650R CS sprocket after 2,100 miles of wear.
spudrollersandsplines034.JPG
As the photo indicates, the wear on my countershaft splines has been arrested by the XRR sprocket. My XR650R countershaft sprocket and drive chain are also wearing normally. Therefore, I consider this experiment a success. I will definitely continue to employ the XR650R countershaft sprockets for my XR650L motorcycle. Spud

Reply by Van Gogh on 07/12/2011 01:32:45 AM
Spud, please will you just confirm the correct way to install this sprocket and also how to align it with the swingarm chain slider as I have asked the mechanics at Honda and other mechanics and for the life of me I just want them to understand how it works as they have never heard of such a mod before. Does the flat side face outwards away from the engine casing and the side with the collar face towards the engine casing? Is the retaining clip attached to the flat side of the sprocket?

What size Gold x-ring chain with how many links will fit my new XR650L fitted with a 15 tooth XR650R front sprocket and 45 tooth rear standard sprocket without having to cut the chain? Should I get the masterlink or the other link,I think it is called pressed link?

I have purchased a Primary Drive XR650R front sprocket,is it any good and a reputable sprocket or should I purchase an OEM XR650R front sprocket? Thanks

Reply by Virginian on 07/12/2011 09:27:35 AM
I'm not Spud but i am not too far from where you are now, having had to figure it out myself.
Does the flat side face outwards away from the engine casing and the side with the collar face towards the engine casing? Yes
Is the retaining clip attached to the flat side of the sprocket? Yes

What size Gold x-ring chain with how many links will fit my new XR650L fitted with a 15 tooth XR650R front sprocket and 45 tooth rear standard sprocket without having to cut the chain? Size 520 - 110 links
Should I get the masterlink or the other link,I think it is called pressed link? Either will work, your choice. I think the clip style is easier myself.

I have purchased a Primary Drive XR650R front sprocket,is it any good and a reputable sprocket or should I purchase an OEM XR650R front sprocket? Primary Drive seem fine from what I have seen. I have a Primary Drive rear steel and a JT front.

Note - You may have to grind a little on the back side of the sprocket to get it to seat enough to put the retainer in the slot. I did. Another guy with the same sprocket did not. You won't know until you try is my opinion.

Reply by SpudRider on 07/12/2011 10:09:36 AM
I agree with everything Virginian has stated. You should install the XR650R CS sprocket as shown in the following photograph.
ChainrollersXRRsprocketinspection032.JPG
Any 520 drive chain, with a length of 110-links, will fit a 15T/45T sprocket combination on your XR650L.

The Primary Drive rear sprocket has worked well for me on my XR650L, so I just bought another one. I just replaced a smaller, 45-tooth, Primary Drive rear sprocket with a larger, 48-tooth, Primary Drive rear sprocket.

As I reported earlier in this thread, I needed to tap lightly with a hammer on my first, PBI, XR650R countershaft sprocket to get the retaining plate on the sprocket. However, after the initial installation, that first, XR650R countershaft sprocket, and the next one, were easily removed, and re-installed by hand.

I recently installed a 14T, Primary Drive, XR650R countershaft sprocket. As others have related, the Primary Drive, XR650R countershaft sprocket seems to be a bit wider than other XR650R sprockets. Therefore, I once again needed to tap lightly with a hammer to attach the retaining plate. I didn't need to grind the Primary Drive, countershaft sprocket, as others have reported, because the thinner, PBI countershaft sprockets I had installed earlier had slightly modified the countershaft, and made the installation easier. Therefore, I recommend you install a thinner, XR650R countershaft sprocket for the first sprocket. If you use a thinner sprocket first, the Primary Drive, countershaft sprocket will be easier to install later. Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 07/16/2011 12:27:25 AM
I recently installed a new, RK520EXW drive chain, and 14T/48T sprockets. Therefore, I seized the opportunity to examine my countershaft splines, and the XR650R countershaft sprocket I was replacing. Here is a photograph of my countershaft splines after employing two, XR650R countershaft sprockets for a combined total of 10,400 miles.
cssplinessprocketsdrivechain7-8-11013.JPG
Here is a photograph of the "front" side of the 13T, Moose Racing, XR650R countershaft sprocket I removed.
cssplinessprocketsdrivechain7-8-11023.JPG
Here is a photograph of the "back" side of the 13T, Moose Racing, XR650R countershaft sprocket I removed.
cssplinessprocketsdrivechain7-8-11022.JPG
I replaced my 45T, Primary Drive, rear sprocket with a 48T, Primary Drive rear sprocket.
cssplinessprocketsdrivechain7-8-11033.JPG
I replaced my 13T, Moose Racing, XR650R CS sprocket with a 14T, Primary Drive, XR650R CS sprocket.
cssplinessprocketsdrivechain7-8-11028.JPG
As others have reported, the Primary Drive, XR650R CS sprocket is wider than some others. Therefore, I once again needed to lightly tap this CS sprocket onto the countershaft with a hammer in order to attach the retaining plate.
cssplinessprocketsdrivechain7-8-11062.JPG
After the initial installation, my PBI and Moose Racing, XR650R CS sprockets were easily removed, and reinstalled by hand. I have read reports the XR650R CS sprocket manufactured by Sprocket Specialists is even thinner than the PBI sprocket. Therefore, I recommend X650L owners should install one of these three, thinner sprockets first, and install the Primary Drive, XR650R CS sprocket later.
OTride7-13-11034.JPG
Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 07/30/2011 09:40:31 AM
Yesterday I changed my rear tire, so I took the opportunity to examine my countershaft splines. Here is a photograph of my countershaft after employing three, XR650R countershaft sprockets for a total of 12,750 miles.
CSsplinesroller026.JPG
Here is a photo of the "front" of my Primary Drive, XR650R countershaft sprocket after 2,350 miles of wear.
CSsplinesroller038.JPG
Here is a photo of the "back" of my Primary Drive, XR650R countershaft sprocket after 2,350 miles of wear.
CSsplinesroller035.JPG
I easily removed my Primary Drive, countershaft sprocket by hand. However, I was surprised to discover I once again needed to "persuade" the PD sprocket back onto the countershaft by lightly tapping it with a hammer before I could attach the retaining plate! The Primary Drive, XR650R, countershaft sprockets are definitely thicker than the other XR650R sprockets I have employed on my XR650L. Therefore, I suggest you use a thinner sprocket the first time you install an XR650R sprocket on your countershaft. My experience indicates the PBI, and the Moose Racing, XR650R CS sprockets are thinner than the Primary Drive, XR650R CS sprockets. Spud

Reply by SpudRider on 08/04/2011 11:24:53 PM
Once again, here is a quick photographic review of my experience using the XR650R countershaft sprocket on my XR650L for the last 12,750 miles. First, here is a photo of my countershaft splines before I started employing the XR650R CS sprocket.
countershaftsplines007.jpg
This is a photo of my countershaft after employing the XRR sprocket for 1,200 miles.
CSSplinesChainRollerInspection006.JPG
Here is a photograph of my countershaft after employing the XR650R CS sprocket for 4,000 miles.
XRLCSsplinesCSsprocket008.JPG
Here is my XR650L countershaft after employing the XR650R countershaft sprocket for 5,600 miles.
ChainrollersXRRsprocketinspection006.JPG
Here is a photograph of my countershaft splines after employing the XR650R CS sprocket for 7,700 miles.
spudrollersandsplines018.JPG
Here is a photograph of my countershaft splines after employing two, XR650R countershaft sprockets for a combined total of 10,400 miles.
cssplinessprocketsdrivechain7-8-11013.JPG
Finally, here is a photograph of my countershaft after employing three, XR650R countershaft sprockets for a total of 12,750 miles.
CSsplinesroller026.JPG
Spud

Reply by Virginian on 08/05/2011 03:02:44 AM
I get worried about how much "Tapping" is required to force the sprocket to move up the shaft just to fit. What I worry about is everything that is attached to the shaft. Like the bearings, and the transmission drum and all those goodies that i know absolutely NOTHING about. I get that the bike was designed to take a huge stress tolerance to abuse from the direction of the crank, but I don't know if Honda designed the motor to take abuse from a different direction.. Does that make sense? That's why I didn't forcefully hammer the sprocket on in the manner you described.
I'm with you. I have seen way too many bearings fail from being "tapped" on to want to risk that at all. My JT sprocket wasn't even close to fitting, so I stuck it in the drill press at work and cut down the back side enough for a snug fit. If it wasn't for all the guys showing good results using an 'R' sprocket, I would buy an un-machined sprocket and get it broached by a machine shop for a proper close tolerance fit like it should be. No excuse for that sloppy of a fit on something that takes that kind of a beating. I would have preferred it if they had made it a slight interference fit and you could press it on and off easy enough and the splines would have never been a problem to begin with.

Reply by Bikerdude on 08/20/2011 5:27:14 PM
I just replaced the chain and both sprockets on my 2002 BRB and went with a 15 tooth XR650R Sunstar up front with a 49 tooth rear. Also am trying out an X-ring gold chain. After cleaning up the counter shaft with a small fine brass brush and coating it with anti-sieze, it slid right on with little effort as did the keeper plate. No hammer needed here. :-) The counter shaft is showing no noticeable wear but with just 2500 miles on the bike, I'd expect none. Thanks SpudRider for the suggestion.

Reply by SpudRider on 08/20/2011 11:31:15 PM
You're welcome, Dude. Thanks for giving the good report on the Sunstar XR650R sprockets! Spud

Reply by dman3998 on 08/27/2011 10:30:01 PM
I just changed mine out with a 650R sprocket from Moose, (probably made by Sunstar) I had no issues either, slipped right on, no pounding, no room to spare, keeper went right on no problem. I have about 11k on it and have not had any noticeable wear with the L sprocket. It was on the 2nd one since stock, I think the hardness of the sprocket makes the biggest difference. but hey what do I know, it makes total sense to have more contact area on the splines, so that's what I am going with from now on. dman

Reply by SpudRider on 08/27/2011 10:50:09 PM
Thanks for the report, DMan. I believe PBI manufactures the XR650R CS sprocket sold by Moose Racing. If you don't have much wear on your countershaft splines, you don't have to tap the sprocket to "persuade" it onto the countershaft. However, the more wear you have on the splines, the more "persuasion" you need to apply to install the XR650R CS sprocket. Spud

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XR650L w/650R CS Sprocket Protects Splines 4

Post by 4Strokes » Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:59 pm

Reply by SpudRider on 09/25/2012 12:38:39 PM
I installed a new drive chain and new sprockets today. Therefore, I seized the opportunity to examine my XR650L's countershaft splines. Here's a photograph of my bike's countershaft after riding 27,000 miles with XR650R C/S sprockets.
BSBandCSsplines033.JPG
For the purpose of reference, here is a photograph of my countershaft before I installed my first, XR650R C/S sprocket.
countershaftsplines007.jpg
Spud

Reply by Bistineau on 09/25/2012 1:56:48 PM
I read this whole thread and have not seen mention of my question. My question being, why not use a factory Honda XR650R CS sprocket rather than an aftermarket? I am thinking of making the switch, but was thinking of getting the Honda XR650R instead of one of the others. Would there be any downside to doing this, or any better advantages with the others? It seems the one FROM Honda would most likely fit the best right off the bat.

Reply by SpudRider on 09/25/2012 3:27:45 PM
The only downside of which I am aware is the additional cost for an OEM, Honda sprocket. However, I do know the PBI and Moose Racing, XR650R C/S sprockets are thinner than some others, and also have a deeper chamfer. Therefore, the PBI/Moose Racing C/S sprockets are easier to "persuade" onto the XR650L's countershaft. I haven't measured the width of the OEM, Honda, XR650R C/S sprockets. Spud

Reply by Bistineau on 09/26/2012 4:39:11 PM
Stopped at the local Honda shop and got me a XR650R CS sprocket on order, $21.99 for a 15 T. That's a lower price than the ones already mentioned above. Should be here Tuesday. One of the parts guys was telling me I might be wanting one for a XR600R as it is the air cooled engine and the 650R is water cooled, he said the 650R is a totally different engine. I had to mention to him that this part, is part of the transmission not the engine. He said he had not heard of these parts being interchangeable, we will see. I bet he might check with the service manager to see if they fit or not, that's not to say he knows either.

Reply by SpudRider on 09/26/2012 9:04:56 PM
I like the PBI, XR650R C/S sprocket which sells for $18.25. This sprocket is thinner than some others, and also has a deeper chamfer. Therefore, the PBI C/S sprocket is easier to "persuade" onto the XR650L's countershaft. Please do let us know how easily the OEM, Honda, XR650R C/S sprocket fits the countershaft of your XR650L motorcycle. Spud

Reply by pma4x4 on 11/03/2014 11:01:32 AM
Hey Spudrider, I don't mean to hijack your thread but I couldn't get a hold of you any other way. I was wanting to PM you a question in regards to another subject but I could not find contact info in your profile. I am trying to find a windscreen for my XRL and I found an image over on another forum you posted on (chinariders) and I was curious as to which cee baileys windscreen is that and how did you get it to fit the protaper bars?
P1020821.JPG
Reply by Bistineau on 11/04/2014 2:59:43 PM
Please do let us know how easily the OEM, Honda, XR650R C/S sprocket fits the countershaft of your XR650L motorcycle.
Spud: I guess I failed to check back in after getting the new sprocket. I had to work on it a little with a 4.5" side grinder to get the retainer ring back on. Removed maybe 0.018-0.020 to make it fit, but it went on. I greased the shaft and exposed metal on the sprocket with grease while installing. with the grease on the sprocket, and subsequent chain lube I don't think it will rust any.

Reply by dave_cl on 11/05/2014 2:08:10 PM
I hit the chamfered ends of the splines of the sprocket (side facing the case) with a Dremel tool to get my 650R sprocket to fit.

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